A lot of people have been asking if we are working on anything specific, and the answer is, well, yes.. Yes we are.

ShadowWars was originally slated to replace DarkGalaxy as a dominant Space Based Strategy, we’ve taken what could be defined as a lot of the problems with the DarkGalaxy game play, and tried to improve on them as much as possible, resulting in a game which is much easier to pick up and play, and is more balanced. Below I’m going to list a few of the features, and attempt to explain the reasoning behind them. Please note: All information provided here is subject to change during game development.

Endless Gameplay

One of the things that gets frequently brought to our attention about DG, is the inability to complete games due to the turn limit, one of the first things we want to do with ShadowWars is just give an end condition of “total annihilation”, and leave the game running permanently until this occurs. This has been made possible with faction based game play (see below), and allows games to last weeks / months maybe even years if people continue to fight the good fight.

Faction Based Gameplay

One of the bigger problems in DG is the ability for a single large alliance to just dominate, the goals were to get as many good people into your alliance as possible, resulting in what could be defined as ’superpowers’ in the universe, if any small alliance stepped in the way, they were trodden on, and newer players to the game were having difficulties getting any sort of foothold without submitting to them.

The concept behind factions, is that there are only two opposing sides fighting against each other. The concept of alliances will still remain inside the greater faction, but you can only war against those on the other side. This essentially allows for ’squads’ of people forcing their way forward (see Navigation below) and working together towards the end goal. We will be looking to add bonuses for working in an alliance, so it’s not something to be completely ignored, but those at this point are changing frequently. This allows players to not only go lone-wolf if they choose, but it gives them a chance to make an impact in some way.

Linear Navigation

The change to navigation is quite substantial, we will be moving from the current system, and making something new and shiny. We’re basing the entire game in a single galaxy, which happens to be dark (just a coincidence :p). We’re running around the idea that to get from A->C, you have to go through B. Each system will have several planets, and at least one ‘SpaceGate’ (Name subject to change) connecting it to nearby systems. You will go through the gates, travel across a systems, then go out the gate on the other side, then rinse / repeat until you’ve reached your destination. To make things interesting, it will be possible to place fleets on either end of the gate, and have them ambush opposing fleets coming through. This adds an interesting dynamic to the game, as due to navigation paths, there may be some key systems which should be defended to the best of their ability, but at the same time, the opposing faction will be working together to destroy your block and exploit it as a good entrance into your territory. This is where teamwork comes into play heavily, the fighting will be a tense back and forth in the center of the galaxy.. Oh, and to add to the fun, there will be no homeworld protection, it will take a LONG time to get back there and the journey will be full of peril, but flanking them would be hugely beneficial to your faction!

At the end of the day, pictures speak louder than words, so there are some example images of something that’s been worked on. Again, this is FAR from complete, it’s more of a test application which we’ve been playing about with, but should give you a reasonable idea of what i’m talking about. Click the thumbnails to expand them.

Simplified Gameplay

To help keep new players participating in games, the game mechanics are going to be easier to understand, to that end, we hope to drop the number of resources down to two (maybe three), but there will be no location population, and we’ll also be doing away with research. Game cues will prompt users on how to do things, and a UI featuring more modern web technologies (for example, drag and drop) will allow the user to do things like edit queues easily and efficiently. We will also be dropping the number of combat ready ships to a handful, and adopting more of a ‘rock-paper-scissors’ approach to combat, but maintaining enough depth for the hard-core strategists to put their skill to use.

Admittedly, there will be a lot of questions / comments about this subject specifically, please feel free to voice them in the comment section, please remember that all comments are moderated to avoid inappropriateness. Thanks for reading :)

Posted Monday, August 11th, 2008 at 1:21 pm
Filed Under Category: General
You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

27

Responses to “Shadow Wars - The beginning”

Chronus

/me goes read up on shortest path algorithms ;)

Whilibarj

Check for Dijkstra Algorithm if you really are into it :)

codu

This sounds very interesting brother. I am very excited about it, and look forward to trying it.

Keep up the good work and keep us up to date.

Supremo

I must say, reading the idea behind navigation really excited me.

I liked it a lot, the idea of irregular traveling is very good, in order to promote brain use ;)

Looking forward from any news you guys throw out

FrostyCoolSlug

Whili: you just gave me a headache.. I can live safe in the knowledge that anything like that wouldn’t be on my shoulders ;D

Imca

This looks promising :) id really like this new travel system although it reminds me a bit of EVE ;) (gatecamps ^^ ).

What i wonder is if the universe as shown on the picture is still a square. what i mean is that the ones in the corners can control a big space with relative short borders. or is the universe another form like a globe so we have to watch our back in each direction?

Another thing that popped in mind is about alliance fleets. Would be cool if you can submit parts of your fleet to the alliance and that they can control them for a limited amouth of time. ( e.g. when your gateblock is failing and your not around then someone in control can move your fleet out) .

Scrughat

really nice ideas…its like Masters of orion 2 …and i really like this kind of games:)

FrostyCoolSlug

Imca: the navigation is a square. The intention is to start players off on either side, and let them fight it out through the middle. Although the navigation MAY have been slightly inspired by Eve, we took ideas from a lot of different games which have done this type of navigation successfully (including EVE), and made all the good parts into our own web based version.

As far as fleet ’sharing’ goes, I think that could be an issue as far as it makes it a lot easier for someone to babysit (which is what you are proposing, just to a lesser level), it also helps to remove the players activity.

One comment that came up on IRC earlier today was that we need to be careful not to have the game completely run itself, and require players to be reasonably active. Although it’s difficult to balance off activity vs. not enough time, we should avoid options which let other people play parts of the game for you. You should consider using teamwork to bolster up defenses if you know you’re not going to be able to stop an attack!

Larry LaFave

/me sits back, relax’s and waits for the email to start the game ;)

Whilibarj

Frosty : actually had to code that crap at uni. THAT gave me headaches…

cox

this looks nice and shiny, but still like at least a year worth of work to reach a beta, right?

people shouldnt get overexited, this is all still ideas :/

on the other hand theyre nice ideas, so i hope youll kick the crap out of ogame and the other trash out there, and code a brilliant game ;)

btw: will the game be tickbased? because if not, that’d be about it with teambased gameplay :p

FrostyCoolSlug

It will indeed be Turn Based, and you’re right, it’s still quite a way out.. But we’ll be working as fast as we can on it, hopefully it wont be a year ;)

Raptor

Are there are other games then just space based strategy games being planned? Or even allready being created? ;-)

I was looking for old threads by Zedd about other games, but couldn’t find them :-(

rozza89

last round of DG i was thinking to myself “why is this called dark galaxy when there are 15 galaxies?”

then it was announced that the game was being suspended, so i never bothered saying anything in the forums.

new game sounds good, exept for one thing i thought of last night.
you say there are only two sides this time, does this mean we are automatically recruited into S.O.L or S.O.D? lol

Zedd

No one alliance will be able to dominate the faction it is in, membership limits will help keep them in check. Ultimately even if there are are large percentage of SOL members in one faction, ALL members that faction are in the same boat, defeat the enemy or be destroyed, so cooperation will be important.

Remember there are only two sides - so all the alliances have to decide which they are starting in, which will hopefully result in a even spread in most games.

An issue perhaps will be where there are several very organised alliances in one faction, and a large number of less organised ones in the other. This will result in a rather quick game though!

There will be an opportunity here for alliance-specific games (e.g. SOL vs OPA) setup for major alliances to really get there teeth into each other, only the biggest alliances need apply though.

@Raptor - Although Dark Conflict and Tycoon Wars have solid foundations in terms of concepts, I am 100% behind ONLY working on Shadow Wars as the flag ship game for the new Turn Engine framework.

FrostyCoolSlug

Raptor: we do have other games on a list, but we’re working one at a time.

rozza: with regards to the two factions, pretty much, yeah :D

Dolon Posted something in the wrong thread:

Hmm, from the sound of things, the new game is going to be a lot less tactical than the old. Fewer ships, no research, it sounds a lot like a game of Risk with more players. While I agree that there were aspects to DG’s combat system that were overly complex (especially when that part of the code changed every round, and once or twice in the middle of a round), but please don’t go so far in the other direction that the possible tactics are so limited as to make it dull.

The most persistant feedback we’ve recieved has been related to over-simplification, please know that this wasn’t our direct intention.

One of the things which research gives, is a gain at a sacrifice, if you want a better economy, you have to sacrifice combat potential. We will be looking into other ways to replicate this sort of behaviour, in other ways.

There are still a lot of things to be finalised, what was posted here was just a taster of what’s to come :)

Imca

well i think it doesnt matter if the game is easier to learn. It would be better if you want more players that wont be killed 3 rounds in a row before they know how it works.

On the other hand i think that it would be nice that if players want too they can make this game more complex. The basics of the game should be easy to learn but there are ways to give the addict what he wants with specialised gameplay. If 80% of the gameplay is easy you can add 20% stuff that gives the addict what he wants without giving him too much of an advantage over a standard player but would still be enough to keep the game interested. You dont want people leaving because of easy game and gameplay. But you also dont want to scare them away with complex stuff. How to balance that is up too you guys ;) but there are a lot of ways to keep the experienced player interested without harming the level of the new player.

beurk

i agree with Imca.
i’d like to see us coding our own combat simulators or similar tools again :D

Stormbringer

Sounds very interesting! I’m lovin what I’m hearing!

Sting

:D u still count SoL :D damn i`ll love to see SoL in this new game .. but i doubt :( Atleast it will be again All vs SoL caolition :D

Dactyl

The new navigations looks cool!

do you guys expect to have a first beta running before x-mas? or do we have to expect that you need atleast one year to finish it? ( question purely our of curiousity!)

“zedd: An issue perhaps will be where there are several very organised alliances in one faction, and a large number of less organised ones in the other. This will result in a rather quick game though!”

aren’t you trying to get rid of the whole idea of having alliances? I mean… If there are going to be only to factions remaining. what is the point of having differend alliances within 1 faction? maybe I just missa understood.

anyway keep de good werk up!

Dactyl :)

MagpieFL

to reduce the power of alliances within each faction, assign the players randomly.

DarkRuler

uh ah :)

Aslan

Skip the lengthy explanations! Just tell me when the first round start and where I sign :D

/Aslan

LordNoble

Anyway this new game looks exciting. New concepts to learn and to master. My big thing is the two faction deal. How many players are you anticipating to be in one faction? If you have 300-400 players in one faction then coordination would become a nightmare even amongst the most dedicated and skilled players.

Could you not implement regiments for the new factions? Maybe give some sort bonuses to regiments when they fight together.

LN

oh, if I don’t get an invite from you posers I will string you up by your toenails!

GRRRRRR

atk

Hi,

Everything sounds very good and exciting and so on.
But reading through the lines I get the bad impression that its a little bit too simplified.
Resources down to two, no research etc. etc. I think that making it easier is good but I don’t think making too simple will be better either.

Research for instance i strongly believe should always be part of a game regardless of what type.
And gave history shows that almost all games besides some shooters perhaps have some research system of their own.
For RPG it is the level you gain ( You research higher level spells or improve the ones you already have ), for strategy your research technologies to build better stuff, etc.
So please consider how much you are removing from the game and what is going remain so that in the end we don’t end up with a couple of buttons and a label “Click Me”.

Other stuff like Navigation and Ships changes seems very good. As well as the two opposing factions i have always loved this kind of setting. :)

Regards,
atk

waster

fame would be a good incentive for alliances within the factions. those alliances that take the most enemy systems, make the most credits, or fight the most battles could all be ways in which alliances could compete with one another. some sort of alliance wide bonus could be applied when an alliance reached a certain level of fame in a given category. i.e. earn enough fame through credits and ‘purchasing’ new merchant ranks would be cheaper for the whole alliance or enough fame through battle and earn some sort of combat bonus for the alliance. nothing serious just 1% per level of fame.

Leave a Reply